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April 2024 Weather Video of the Month Post your nominations now!
Significant Tornado Events
- Thread starter locomusic01
- Start date
SpotlightForRareTornadoes
Member
I have always wondered: has there been a landspout tornado that was rated EF4?
SpotlightForRareTornadoes
Member
SpotlightForRareTornadoes
Member
Tornado Archive just got updated!
SpotlightForRareTornadoes
Member
It now includes events like Rolling Fork, Keota, and Didsbury! 
Juliett Bravo Kilo
Member
Found some more pics of Guin that I either colorized or are already in color, you can see how intense this thing was & how narrow the F5 core was. Some of these were in a post by loco that he thought was mostly from Madison County but I think quite a few of them were from Marion County where Guin, a handful I'm sure are from Guin. I'll post them & analysis of them now:
First off, these, B&W and color pics. Note the ground scouring & large field of debris in both sets:
This color photo has a ground-level in newspapers.com, I'll post both here & provide analysis of them:
Note the house that looks like it slid off it's foundation & is partially damaged but still somewhat intact in the plot of land with lots of debris wind-rowed over it in the B&W pic & note how in this pic that field by the aforementioned house is almost completely scoured of grass & likely has topsoil dug out at least several inches. Note the tire tracks across that plot of land too as that's a common site with F5/EF5 damage, as the ground is scouring so thoroughly car tracks are visible on it. You see this with stuff like Udall, Smithville, etc. It's remarkable how narrow Guin's F5 core was & how selective the damage was; likely a combination of inner core & a multivortex structure. The ground scouring it did is likely the most intense from that day (although I'd like to see more photos of both Tanner tornado damage & Brandenburg for comparison) and shows that Guin lives up to its reputation. If it was moving in excess of 70mph as Grazulis that kind of scouring is EXTREMELY impressive given how narrow the core was & that there wouldn't be much time to scour grass or soil from the ground.
First off, these, B&W and color pics. Note the ground scouring & large field of debris in both sets:
This color photo has a ground-level in newspapers.com, I'll post both here & provide analysis of them:
Note the house that looks like it slid off it's foundation & is partially damaged but still somewhat intact in the plot of land with lots of debris wind-rowed over it in the B&W pic & note how in this pic that field by the aforementioned house is almost completely scoured of grass & likely has topsoil dug out at least several inches. Note the tire tracks across that plot of land too as that's a common site with F5/EF5 damage, as the ground is scouring so thoroughly car tracks are visible on it. You see this with stuff like Udall, Smithville, etc. It's remarkable how narrow Guin's F5 core was & how selective the damage was; likely a combination of inner core & a multivortex structure. The ground scouring it did is likely the most intense from that day (although I'd like to see more photos of both Tanner tornado damage & Brandenburg for comparison) and shows that Guin lives up to its reputation. If it was moving in excess of 70mph as Grazulis that kind of scouring is EXTREMELY impressive given how narrow the core was & that there wouldn't be much time to scour grass or soil from the ground.
CheeselandSkies
Member
Another one of those tornado events that was not all that "significant" in the scheme of things but did produce at least a few EF2+ from northern Iowa to central Texas took place two years ago on this day, April 12, 2022. For me it was another in the long string of "targeted well but either abandoned my target or botched the intercept" heartbreakers that defined my chase career until March 31 of last year. I was in Fort Dodge, IA when the initial severe thunderstorm warning went out on what would become the supercell of the day, but I drove up to Humboldt and held my ground there waiting for it to come to me. Meanwhile, it produced a highly photogenic EF2 from near Palmer to near Gilmore City.
By the time the storm did get to me, it was still producing tornadoes but some upscale growth/clustering had commenced and the area of interest had become quite rain-wrapped and any sunlight that might have illuminated it blocked by shadowing from other storms. This photo was taken with my phone, from 230th St. on the west edge of Humboldt at 6:41 PM. A second EF2 tornado was occurring at this time, northwest of Rutland/east of Bradgate to south of Bode, and this is looking northwest toward its location.
With heavy contrast enhancement in Photoshop (and an even more enhanced/highlighted area on the duplicate), toward the lower center of the image I can make out what looks like it *might* be an RFD clear slot and classic "horseshoe" updraft base, with a gray-on-slightly-lighter-gray mass extending toward the ground beneath it. Is it the tornado? Impossible to say for sure. This was at least my third chase on which I was within two miles of a confirmed, ongoing tornado and shooting right towards it, yet it cannot be clearly discerned in my imagery.
A few minutes later, I also saw the closest cloud-to-ground lightning strike I've ever captured on video:
en.wikipedia.org
By the time the storm did get to me, it was still producing tornadoes but some upscale growth/clustering had commenced and the area of interest had become quite rain-wrapped and any sunlight that might have illuminated it blocked by shadowing from other storms. This photo was taken with my phone, from 230th St. on the west edge of Humboldt at 6:41 PM. A second EF2 tornado was occurring at this time, northwest of Rutland/east of Bradgate to south of Bode, and this is looking northwest toward its location.
With heavy contrast enhancement in Photoshop (and an even more enhanced/highlighted area on the duplicate), toward the lower center of the image I can make out what looks like it *might* be an RFD clear slot and classic "horseshoe" updraft base, with a gray-on-slightly-lighter-gray mass extending toward the ground beneath it. Is it the tornado? Impossible to say for sure. This was at least my third chase on which I was within two miles of a confirmed, ongoing tornado and shooting right towards it, yet it cannot be clearly discerned in my imagery.
A few minutes later, I also saw the closest cloud-to-ground lightning strike I've ever captured on video:
April 2022 North American storm complex - Wikipedia
SpotlightForRareTornadoes
Member
How The Death of Franklin D. Roosevelt Completely Covered Up One of the Worst Tornado Outbreaks in Oklahoma's history: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tornado_outbreak_of_April_12,_1945
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SpotlightForRareTornadoes
Member
1945 National Headlines: President Roosevelt Dies!
In the very top right corner of the newspaper: "WIND EVENT KILLS 128"
In the very top right corner of the newspaper: "WIND EVENT KILLS 128"
Again, hard to disagree now with some of the assessments of Guin being an extraordinarily violent tornado with some of these new images, despite hand-me-down stories changing character over the years. That overhead shot of the core damage track is extreme.
Juliett Bravo Kilo
Member
Indeed, it reminds me of Smithville in terms of how narrow the core was and how extreme the damage in the core was.
Western_KS_Wx
Member
Also on this date 4 years ago, the monstrous Bassfield EF4 tornado and Easter 2020 tornado outbreak. Speaking of Bassfield, I recently stumbled upon this which is what Tom Grazulis wrote about the Bassfield EF4.
I really respect Grazulis and he’s one of the most brilliant minds in tornado research history, but to say his statement is a bit of a head scratcher would be a minor understatement. Seems he completely disregarded the several structures that were rated EF4 along the track basing the rating on tree damage…and then calling it minimal. Not only do I HIGHLY disagree with this, he also stated that the max width was 1.1 miles which is a full mile smaller than the official 2.25 mile width..what?
Here’s some screen grabs on where the tornado almost certainly peaked in intensity on a stretch from Willie Fortenberry Rd to Kings Rd:
This sequence of images shows extreme damage along and near Willie Fortenberry Rd to Kings Rd. The tornado literally scoured a section of forest to the ground before impacting a grove of trees and producing some of the most impressive tree damage I’ve seen from a Dixie Alley tornado. Large trees and shrubs were fully debarked and reduced to featureless stubs, some of which were sheared down to stumps only a few feet above ground level. Pronounced ground scouring was clearly evident in this area as well. The tornado then entered another forested area where swaths of trees were once again essentially scoured down to the ground and completely debarked. After this point the damage gradually weakened before the tornado ballooned to over 2 miles wide, but damage within this section of the path was in my opinion undoubtedly indicative of EF5 strength, and certainly not a minimal EF4.
As for the max width of the tornado, which Grazulis listed at 1.1 miles instead of 2.25 miles, I leave you with this:
I really respect Grazulis and he’s one of the most brilliant minds in tornado research history, but to say his statement is a bit of a head scratcher would be a minor understatement. Seems he completely disregarded the several structures that were rated EF4 along the track basing the rating on tree damage…and then calling it minimal. Not only do I HIGHLY disagree with this, he also stated that the max width was 1.1 miles which is a full mile smaller than the official 2.25 mile width..what?
Here’s some screen grabs on where the tornado almost certainly peaked in intensity on a stretch from Willie Fortenberry Rd to Kings Rd:
This sequence of images shows extreme damage along and near Willie Fortenberry Rd to Kings Rd. The tornado literally scoured a section of forest to the ground before impacting a grove of trees and producing some of the most impressive tree damage I’ve seen from a Dixie Alley tornado. Large trees and shrubs were fully debarked and reduced to featureless stubs, some of which were sheared down to stumps only a few feet above ground level. Pronounced ground scouring was clearly evident in this area as well. The tornado then entered another forested area where swaths of trees were once again essentially scoured down to the ground and completely debarked. After this point the damage gradually weakened before the tornado ballooned to over 2 miles wide, but damage within this section of the path was in my opinion undoubtedly indicative of EF5 strength, and certainly not a minimal EF4.
As for the max width of the tornado, which Grazulis listed at 1.1 miles instead of 2.25 miles, I leave you with this:
Juliett Bravo Kilo
Member
I think Grazulis is going senile/acquiring dementia in his old age. Likely the same reason he didn't rank Vilonia, Chapman, Goldsby, Chickasha or Tuscaloosa-Birmingham as EF5s. This thing is high-end EF4, at least.
Western_KS_Wx
Member
That tornado was a lot more violent than some realize, one of the more underrated tornadoes that likely reached EF5 intensity in my opinion, thankfully stayed out in the middle of no where. These two videos show the incredibly violent motion and multiple vortices rotating around the tornado, likely maintained violent EF4+ intensity for the majority of its lifetime.
In the second video around 14:15 ground scouring is visible along with extensive tree damage when the chasers cross the damage path.
OHWX97
Member
Team TWISTEX's video of the Langley tornado is easily one of my all time favorites.
Lol that's a bit mean. But like many old researchers, he's got ideas that he formulates and holds onto that are sometimes a bit out there. Some of his tweets people have posted here I though were rather cringe-worthy in terms of their ideas. Fact is he's a human and is subject to all the same foibles and biases. He deserves a lot of respect for accomplishing an enormous amount of historical research in an era when that meant going to physical libraries and archives and rummaging through dusty files and old newspapers. But even given his enormous knowledge it doesn't mean his ideas are all correct or that they can't be superseded. That's just the nature of interpreting historical data.
Juliett Bravo Kilo
Member
I wasn't saying that to be mean, I was being serious. When my grandfather got dementia he said more and more outlandish things as time went on until the inevitable. Just the way ageing is. I really do wonder if he's suffering some cognitive decline.
Sorry deleted previous comment. I misunderstood what the point you were trying to get across. Grazulis does seem to be strangely dismissive of Bassfield, and it absolutely was a high-end EF4 tornado that was likely capable of producing legit EF5 damage.
I do agree with JAN’s assessment of high-end EF4 though. That’s as high as they could go. If you’ve seen a “before” picture of the cabin that got slabbed, you’ll understand why. It was a small tin-roofed outbuilding-like structure. They leaves us with the extreme debarking, scouring, and vehicle damage, but nothing structurally sound enough to fully push it above the high-end EF4 range into EF5 criteria. Same thing happened in Bremen, KY.
Imo, that most recent no-brainer “shoulda been EF5” was Chapman 2016. It’s been quite a while since I’ve seen something truly meet the criteria.
I do agree with JAN’s assessment of high-end EF4 though. That’s as high as they could go. If you’ve seen a “before” picture of the cabin that got slabbed, you’ll understand why. It was a small tin-roofed outbuilding-like structure. They leaves us with the extreme debarking, scouring, and vehicle damage, but nothing structurally sound enough to fully push it above the high-end EF4 range into EF5 criteria. Same thing happened in Bremen, KY.
Imo, that most recent no-brainer “shoulda been EF5” was Chapman 2016. It’s been quite a while since I’ve seen something truly meet the criteria.
Shakespeare 2016
Member
What did he have to say about the Camp Crook, SD/Capitol, MT 2018 tornado? It was certainly much higher than the low-end EF3 rating it got.
Juliett Bravo Kilo
Member
At a hotel out of town & don't have the book on me, will have the answer by Monday.
I've always found that thing fascinating; it touched down right on the state line between Montana & South Dakota & only lasted 3 miles but managed to turn into a photogenic stovepipe long enough to be photographed in its brief existence.
