318 replies to this topic

[ams30721us]

9-1-1 tape of Trayvon screaming for help until he is shot and then its silent. Why would Zimmerman still not be screaming for help or anything else??

[Stormlover]

Quote

Several witnesses heard those cries, and there's been a dispute about from whom they came: Zimmerman or Trayvon.

Lawyers for Trayvon's family say it was Trayvon, but police say their evidence indicates it was Zimmerman.

One witnesses, who has since talked to local television news reporters, told police he saw Zimmerman on the ground with Trayvon on top, pounding him and was unequivocal that it was Zimmerman who was crying for help.

Now, this thread is about CNN, but look at MSNBC. Al is rallying and covering the story too. They can't get any more blatant that they don't care about journalism.
http://mrctv.org/vid...-and-cover-case

Edited by Stormlover, 26 March 2012 - 11:56 AM.

[ams30721us]

Stormlover, on 26 March 2012 - 11:51 AM, said:

Now, this thread is about CNN, but look at MSNBC. Al is rallying and covering the story too. They can't get any more blatant that they don't care about journalism.
http://mrctv.org/vid...-and-cover-case

Thank God!!! Had it not been for his hard work weeks ago and going down there several times to get the details this case would have been covered up as some on here would have loved. Good Job Rev. Al!

[NathansGal]

Listened to the tape a few times, you really can't tell the age of the person screaming....also, why would Trayvon scream "help" over and over if he was running away? The "help screams" last several minutes as if someone was being beat on or held, I don't think Zimmerman stood there with a gun pointed at Trayvon, hence causing him to yell; "help" "don't shoot" would be something someone would say but then again, you're talking about a kid, it may have been instinct to get another adult involved to protect him....or maybe Zimmerman was yelling "help" to back up the fact he was going to shoot the boy....how many eye witness reports are there concerning a scuffle between the two guys....it's obvious by Zimmerman's call to 9-11, he was very hyper-aware and over-reacting plus was NOT doing what dispatch said; "not to pursue the guy" in fact, when the dispatcher suggested a place for Zimmerman and the police to meet, he was evasive and told dispatch to have the police call him and he'd let them know where he was (because he was going to follow Trayvon)....

What benefit did the police department get for not acting sooner about things? Why would they want to protect a hispanic murderer?

I don't think we have nearly all the facts about this....

[ams30721us]

Good for you Jeb Bush! I guess can support on Bush in my day!

http://www.washingto...=all_


ARLINGTON, Texas — Former Florida Gov. Jeb Bush says the “Stand Your Ground” law he signed shouldn’t protect a neighborhood watch captain who hasn’t been arrested in the shooting death of an unarmed teenager.

Bush spoke Friday at the University of Texas at Arlington, just outside Dallas. He told reporters afterward that the Florida law doesn’t apply in the incident that left 17-year-old Trayvon Martin dead.


He said, “Stand your ground means stand your ground. It doesn’t mean chase after somebody who’s turned their back.”

The Dallas Morning News reported (http://dallasne.ws/GWMtOK ) that Bush, who signed the law in 2005, called Martin’s death a tragedy.

George Zimmerman shot and killed Martin in Sanford, Fla., in February. Martin was walking back to the home of his father’s fiancée.

Zimmerman says he acted in self-defense.

___

Edited by ams30721us, 26 March 2012 - 12:32 PM.

[Stormlover]

It was unseasonably warm in Chicago on St. Patrick’s Day. Six-year-old Aliyah Shell was on her front porch getting her hair combed by her mother. The young girl was preparing to attend a birthday party. Suddenly, shots were fired from a passing pickup truck. Aliyah was pronounced dead shortly thereafter. I must have missed the MSNBC coverage. Or Jesse Jackson’s outrage. Or Al Sharpton’s. Or if O thought a third daughter would have looked like Aliyah. Aliyah was one of 49 SHOT, 10 FATALLY, in Chicago that weekend. Wonder how many of those shooters are still at large? Very strange how certain people find some lives more valuable than others

[ams30721us]

Stormlover, on 26 March 2012 - 12:54 PM, said:

It was unseasonably warm in Chicago on St. Patrick’s Day. Six-year-old Aliyah Shell was on her front porch getting her hair combed by her mother. The young girl was preparing to attend a birthday party. Suddenly, shots were fired from a passing pickup truck. Aliyah was pronounced dead shortly thereafter. I must have missed the MSNBC coverage. Or Jesse Jackson’s outrage. Or Al Sharpton’s. Or if O thought a third daughter would have looked like Aliyah. Aliyah was one of 49 SHOT, 10 FATALLY, in Chicago that weekend. Wonder how many of those shooters are still at large? Very strange how certain people find some lives more valuable than others

This is troubling in so many ways! Are you kidding me? Why don't you address the black man who was ran down on video by a racist white teen in Mississippi??  Oh wait because the black community is not outrage because justice was served! Even in Mississippi they actually abide by the law. You have a obvious blind attitude to understand that the outrage in Florida is because of the police allowing a murderer to walk free. That is just a dumb comparison if I have ever saw one.

[Arcadia]

NathansGal, on 26 March 2012 - 12:23 PM, said:

I don't think we have nearly all the facts about this....

Agreed.

[copasetic]

ams30721us, on 26 March 2012 - 01:05 PM, said:

This is troubling in so many ways! Are you kidding me? Why don't you address the black man who was ran down on video by a racist white teen in Mississippi??  Oh wait because the black community is not outrage because justice was served! Even in Mississippi they actually abide by the law. You have a obvious blind attitude to understand that the outrage in Florida is because of the police allowing a murderer to walk free. That is just a dumb comparison if I have ever saw one.

Or just address the number of black men killed by black men today alone I can assure you that number will be larger than a racist white man.

And before you start any crap with me and pull the race card I could care less if someone is orange with green stripes. I just don't give a flying rats tail about it. The whole racism thing is left overs from people who were young in the 60's and 70s.. Like my grandparents sadly, they are. Just like 99% of older black men you can just tell they hate me because I'm white. My oldest boy - his best friend is black. A product of a interracial relationship that went south. They have been friends since meeting in Cub Scouts.. His dad has nothing to do with him and I'm more a father to him coaching/emotional support wise. I'm blessed to have him in our lives when he spends the night..  Just letting you know before you even try it with me.

So what I was going to say I just don't see that young man being murdered because of color. There were no justified reasons at all for it. The race factor is being sensationalized by the media and peanut gallery.

[ams30721us]

Wow..these people on the other side or trying to really turn this from peaceful to violence. Are you kidding me with the empty Marijuana bag suspension being relevant at all? Of course not. But lets demonize this kid as some horrible person. Great defense strategy but really stupid when trying to keep emotions from boiling over. I applaud the parents though who have been amazing through all this and even today having a press conference to urge non violence even as they try and demonize her son. That is awesome.

[ams30721us]

copasetic, on 26 March 2012 - 01:31 PM, said:

Or just address the number of black men killed by black men today alone I can assure you that number will be larger than a racist white man.

And before you start any crap with me and pull the race card I could care less if someone is orange with green stripes. I just don't give a flying rats ass about it. The whole racism thing is left overs from people who were young in the 60's and 70s.. Like my grandparents sadly, they are. Just like 99% of older black men you can just tell they hate me because I'm white. My oldest boy - his best friend is black. A product of a interracial relationship that went south. They have been friends since meeting in Cub Scouts.. His dad has nothing to do with him and I'm more a father to him coaching/emotional support wise. I'm blessed to have him in our lives when he spends the night..  Just letting you know before you even try it with me.

So what I was going to say I just don't see that young man being murdered because of color. There were no justified reasons at all for it. The race factor is being sensationalized by the media and peanut gallery.

Thats fine please continue to be blind about racism. Just to give you a hint Idc that you know a black person and have them in your life. I know tons of White people who are family to me. Hell just check out my facebook and read messages from people like family to me they are White. But lets be clear this was a racial shooting period. Michael Orr's mom who as you know from the movie is white is talking about this and how racism is still very much alive today and that they have experienced it. Lets be clear its a racial issue.

[Titan]

Racism is going to be alive and well in this country for a really long time, as long as people refuse to let go of the events of the past and try to make EVERYTHING into a racial issue.

[Blizzard1]

Ok, I have been sitting to the side a bit thinking about what I'd like to add to this conversation and I have noted a few things as well. First, we don't have all the facts. I don't and nobody else on this forum does either. If your beef is that "the system" unfortunately let Trayvon down then why step out on pure emotion and demand it willfully be circumvented when it comes to how Zimmermen is treated? Is that how justice is best served? To act on par with the first wrong, the original sin? Not in my book. Now don't get me wrong, I am not supporting Zimmerman. I am saying in a case such as this we need to rely on our justice system to carry out any punishment because a street level justice system based largely on raw emotion has historically caused a lot of problems in the past, including a lot of innocent blood being shed and lives being ruined. That is the entire reason we live as a nation of laws.

Now I would like to add that I feel some national figures in particular have SHAMELESSLY tried to use this tragedy. There are a few of the usual suspects who apparently have no issue with the repercussions of what violence may be instigated from their inflammatory rhetoric. Again, is this how justice comes about? Tit plus for tat? Not hardly.

[WBB]

To say that race was not involved in this is nonsense.  Zimmerman profiled the kid because he was black.  He was gonna save the day and stop this hoodlum from terrorizing his neighborhood.  Now, as to what actually caused the shooting, I can't say.  Was it in self-defense?  I don't know.  I am not privy to those details.  However, it has become apparent to me that Trayvon Martin was followed by Zimmerman because he was black.

[ams30721us]

Sad to see the Justice system completly fail but even worse to see them now trying to de humanize this kid...if it was not so sad it would be comical. Race is alive and well in this country and it always will be. Its pretty sad some people actually try to deny it as much as they can. Now with regards to vigilante justice besides that being what Zimmerman did I agree it should not be done but the more people sit on the sidelines with this the more tensions will rise. Sad to see the figures that many on this board hate had to get involved in this case before attention was even paid and action was taken.

[ams30721us]

WBB, on 26 March 2012 - 01:58 PM, said:

To say that race was not involved in this is nonsense.  Zimmerman profiled the kid because he was black.  He was gonna save the day and stop this hoodlum from terrorizing his neighborhood.  Now, as to what actually caused the shooting, I can't say.  Was it in self-defense?  I don't know.  I am not privy to those details.  However, it has become apparent to me that Trayvon Martin was followed by Zimmerman because he was black.

Thanks. Good point. I don't understand how some don't see this as having ANYTHING to do with race. I just don't understand it at all.

[NathansGal]

ams30721us, on 26 March 2012 - 01:33 PM, said:

Wow..these people on the other side or trying to really turn this from peaceful to violence. Are you kidding me with the empty Marijuana bag suspension being relevant at all? Of course not. But lets demonize this kid as some horrible person. Great defense strategy but really stupid when trying to keep emotions from boiling over. I applaud the parents though who have been amazing through all this and even today having a press conference to urge non violence even as they try and demonize her son. That is awesome.

The empty marijuana bag has nothing to do with the situation, it was the first article I read that gave us any history of Trayvon before this incident....we know some about Zimmerman and the fact that he was "self appointed" for the neighborhood watch already gaving us an idea he was taking things into his own hands...drug use and suspension could be a sign that Trayvon might be violent...NOT BECAUSE HE'S BLACK....

AMS, I am looking at ALL angles in this, my knee jerk reaction as a Mama, is to get angry that a young man with the future ahead of him was gunned down while not armed....but then there's the media giving us information...

People act like those of us that question the situation and want more info are demonizing the kid? Have y'all ever thought that getting blacks riled up about "CERTAIN"  (not all) racism situations is the media and rally loving leaders playing you guys??? Even though I'm white, I don't agree with the wrong that has been done but I'm going to also seek way more facts before I make a decision on what exactly happened....

[NathansGal]

ams30721us, on 26 March 2012 - 02:01 PM, said:

Sad to see the Justice system completly fail but even worse to see them now trying to de humanize this kid...if it was not so sad it would be comical. Race is alive and well in this country and it always will be. Its pretty sad some people actually try to deny it as much as they can. Now with regards to vigilante justice besides that being what Zimmerman did I agree it should not be done but the more people sit on the sidelines with this the more tensions will rise. Sad to see the figures that many on this board hate had to get involved in this case before attention was even paid and action was taken.

After reading this, I personally see it this way....
The case did need to come to the attention.....and I think maybe the best way for ALL of us to handle this, is to listen to his family's version of what they truly know happened (given they were told ALL sides of the story) and support them.....however, I think to avoid further problems, the Jesse Jacksons and Al Sharptons should back off, I don't view these men as helpers....I know that Jesse Jackson lived in the world of racism but I am not sure anymore for his motives and I have never taken Al Sharpton seriously, I'm sorry.....this should not be an excuse for the country to divide....it's already semi-happening on this forum...

Either way in all this, a kid died for no good reason other than this Barney Fife decided he looked suspicious....I'm not sure who cried help or why but I really can't see (bloodied nose or not) this kid taking out that guy....this is so sad....

[Blizzard1]

ams30721us, on 26 March 2012 - 02:04 PM, said:

Thanks. Good point. I don't understand how some don't see this as having ANYTHING to do with race. I just don't understand it at all.

ams, this incedent should be upsetting. It should be upsetting to anyone that this young man was shot and killed needlessly regardless of his race or ethnicity. Was this brought about due to Trayvon's race? There's a very good chance it was but we need to let things sort out before we get unhinged with rage and even if it comes down to Zimmerman being guilty on the highest levels that was ZIMMERMAN who did this. Be mad at HIM. If it comes to light that the police department failed as well, be ill with those who erred. These are INDIVIDUALS we are talking about. This crusade you seem to be on kinda smacks of blaming white people in general for what happened. Isn't that kind of mentality you have been espousing the exact same thing you are railing about yourself...blaming a race of people on the acts of individuals?

[ams30721us]

NathansGal, on 26 March 2012 - 02:07 PM, said:

The empty marijuana bag has nothing to do with the situation, it was the first article I read that gave us any history of Trayvon before this incident....we know some about Zimmerman and the fact that he was "self appointed" for the neighborhood watch already gaving us an idea he was taking things into his own hands...drug use and suspension could be a sign that Trayvon might be violent...NOT BECAUSE HE'S BLACK....

AMS, I am looking at ALL angles in this, my knee jerk reaction as a Mama, is to get angry that a young man with the future ahead of him was gunned down while not armed....but then there's the media giving us information...

People act like those of us that question the situation and want more info are demonizing the kid? Have y'all ever thought that getting blacks riled up about "CERTAIN"  (not all) racism situations is the media and rally loving leaders playing you guys??? Even though I'm white, I don't agree with the wrong that has been done but I'm going to also seek way more facts before I make a decision on what exactly happened....

Thats great for you to be slow on justice not everyone else. Its a fact as much as some people are trying to say this has nothing to with race is just sick and wrong. Now with regards to the empty bag, no it does not prove that he is violent. That is my the main point. That is something you would get from that story which is why it was released by Zimmermans attorney. My White college roommates who smoke and sold weed out of my dorm were far from violent or dangerous and they sold to  other college kids to make a few extra bucks. They were engineer and med student majors...Do you really consider them violent because they had an empty bag of Marijuana? What a joke but fact is thats why that type of info is released to try to bring that kid down to some drug dealer description. It still has nothing to do with that night though which makes it worse. When is the media actually going to talk with Zimmermans attorney and blast him about his arrest for assaulting an undercover police officer or domestic violence charges...hmmm maybe that would mean he may be violent. It still has nothing to do with that night.

[WBB]

ams30721us, on 26 March 2012 - 02:04 PM, said:

Thanks. Good point. I don't understand how some don't see this as having ANYTHING to do with race. I just don't understand it at all.

On the other hand, it is a leap to say Zimmerman is a racist and therefore he is also a murderer.  It's not a crime to mutter racial epithets under your breath and follow someone.  Imprudent in this case, but not a crime.  Thats where I think there is so much passion which seems to favor Zimmerman from some posters.  It would appear that people have found him guilty of murder because he profiled the kid.  I appreciate the frustration you feel because Trayvon was profiled simply for being black, but I have yet to see any evidence about the struggle, and I will not make judgment with regard to whether Zimmerman is a murderer until the investigation is done.  However, the whole sequence of events started to unfold because Zimmerman profiled him.

[ams30721us]

Blizzard1, on 26 March 2012 - 02:18 PM, said:

ams, this incedent should be upsetting. It should be upsetting to anyone that this young man was shot and killed needlessly regardless of his race or ethnicity. Was this brought about due to Trayvon's race? There's a very good chance it was but we need to let things sort out before we get unhinged with rage and even if it comes down to Zimmerman being guilty on the highest levels that was ZIMMERMAN who did this. Be mad at HIM. If it comes to light that the police department failed as well, be ill with those who erred. These are INDIVIDUALS we are talking about. This crusade you seem to be on kinda smacks of blaming white people in general for what happened. Isn't that kind of mentality you have been espousing the exact same thing you are railing about yourself...blaming a race of people on the acts of individuals?

Ha nope but nice try. Again let me say it again and again for those who don't know, I was practically raised by White people. Many of them, my best friends, my other friends blah blah are white and I don't hate them for what happened. I hate the police department for no justice and the simple fact that justice has not been served. I do get mad when I hear white people complain about certain leaders getting involved, when without them this case would be swept under the rug.

[Blizzard1]

ams30721us, on 26 March 2012 - 02:21 PM, said:

Ha nope but nice try. Again let me say it again and again for those who don't know, I was practically raised by White people. Many of them, my best friends, my other friends blah blah are white and I don't hate them for what happened. I hate the police department for no justice and the simple fact that justice has not been served. I do get mad when I hear white people complain about certain leaders getting involved, when without them this case would be swept under the rug.

So then what are you wanting from this epic rant you are coming up with ams? What is your goal here?

[ams30721us]

WBB, on 26 March 2012 - 02:21 PM, said:

On the other hand, it is a leap to say Zimmerman is a racist and therefore he is also a murderer.  It's not a crime to mutter racial epithets under your breath and follow someone.  Imprudent in this case, but not a crime.  Thats where I think there is so much passion which seems to favor Zimmerman from some posters.  It would appear that people have found him guilty of murder because he profiled the kid.  I appreciate the frustration you feel because Trayvon was profiled simply for being black, but I have yet to see any evidence about the struggle, and I will not make judgment with regard to whether Zimmerman is a murderer until the investigation is done.  However, the whole sequence of events started to unfold because Zimmerman profiled him.

The thing is though as Jeb Bush said, the law does not allow you to chase an innocent person down with a deadly weapon! Thats beyond the law. So what happens after that is really a moot point. If I was to chase someone down on the street with a gun I am sure that is a crime. So Zimmerman is already commiting a crime to me before you even get to the whole incident or scuffle.

[ams30721us]

Blizzard1, on 26 March 2012 - 02:24 PM, said:

So then what are you wanting from this epic rant you are coming up with ams? What is your goal here?

Justice to be served...

[Blizzard1]

ams30721us, on 26 March 2012 - 02:25 PM, said:

Justice to be served...

Well good heavens, it is in the process of being dealt with. You have to step back and let the justice system work. The ams justice system has Zimmerman beyond convicted before there has been ANY iota of a trial.

[Stormlover]

Blizzard1, on 26 March 2012 - 02:28 PM, said:

Well good heavens, it is in the process of being dealt with. You have to step back and let the justice system work. The ams justice system has Zimmerman beyond convicted before there has been ANY iota of a trial.

Amen. And he legally had the weapon. He's breaking no law by having it as he went down the road. He didn't take the weapon out until he was on his back being pounded on the ground. The stand your ground law is irrelevant here, but what is relevant is was it self defense or not when he used the weapon.

[NathansGal]

ams30721us, on 26 March 2012 - 02:19 PM, said:

Thats great for you to be slow on justice not everyone else. Its a fact as much as some people are trying to say this has nothing to with race is just sick and wrong. Now with regards to the empty bag, no it does not prove that he is violent. That is my the main point. That is something you would get from that story which is why it was released by Zimmermans attorney. My White college roommates who smoke and sold weed out of my dorm were far from violent or dangerous and they sold to  other college kids to make a few extra bucks. They were engineer and med student majors...Do you really consider them violent because they had an empty bag of Marijuana? What a joke but fact is thats why that type of info is released to try to bring that kid down to some drug dealer description. It still has nothing to do with that night though which makes it worse. When is the media actually going to talk with Zimmermans attorney and blast him about his arrest for assaulting an undercover police officer or domestic violence charges...hmmm maybe that would mean he may be violent. It still has nothing to do with that night.

Sometimes marijuana use can become the use of stronger drugs that cause violence....I think it's sad that instead of getting an honest job, your friends sold drugs to earn extra money....I don't respect that nor does it prove a point to me......apparently the media has spoken about Zimmerman or you wouldn't know about these charges against him......

Trayvon was racially profiled, followed and eventually shot....even if he was banging that dudes head on the sidewalk (which is just one speculation), the guy should have had a tazer or pepper spray when self appointed patrolling NOT a gun, then this kid would have had burned eyes or burned spots on his body and his parents could own that neighborhood or whomever would have been held accountable....I still don't understand why there was a cover up...due to the fact a hispanic did the shooting and not someone white or from the police department....the case is ongoing so more facts will come out....

Now that it's being brought out and has people's attention....if rallies and marches continued based on a fever pitch brought in by leaders, y'all are being played and it's not going to help race relations....

[ams30721us]

Blizzard1, on 26 March 2012 - 02:28 PM, said:

Well good heavens, it is in the process of being dealt with. You have to step back and let the justice system work. The ams justice system has Zimmerman beyond convicted before there has been ANY iota of a trial.

Man some people just don't understand at all. THE JUSTICE SYSTEM ALREADY FAILED. What we are seeing now is the system trying to cover its tracks and fixed this BECAUSE of all the outrage. The pressure is going to stay on and that is good to get this right.

[WBB]

ams30721us, on 26 March 2012 - 02:24 PM, said:

The thing is though as Jeb Bush said, the law does not allow you to chase an innocent person down with a deadly weapon! Thats beyond the law. So what happens after that is really a moot point. If I was to chase someone down on the street with a gun I am sure that is a crime. So Zimmerman is already commiting a crime to me before you even get to the whole incident or scuffle.

So why is the point moot?  The real issue in this case now is not whether Zimmerman profiled him or chased him with a deadly weapon. It's whether  Zimmerman murdered Trayvon Martin or whether he shot him in self-defense.  

Then again, I can see that had the police arrested Zimmerman for chasing him with a gun, this would probably not be the explosive story that it has become.  And then again, I think this would have been explosive regardless.  

What a mess.